port the IDB, but at the same time they are the kind of thing nobody really opposes, but everybody puts relatively lower on the scale than their own self-interest.

We as Members in Congress are faced with constituencies that often times don't understand the benefits given directly to our country in terms of national security, in terms of the exports that we will be producing and the contracts, not to mention the humanitarian aspects of just making sure that the rest of the world improves its standard of living.

Do any of you have any suggestions that you would like to leave with our subcommittee, in view of arguments down the line, when we are faced with large budget deficits and domestic needs, do you feel there is anything else you can say as to the need for strong support of the MDB's? Do you feel it is covered pretty well? Mr. Dean.

Mr. DEAN. I just might add that I think we have not done a very good job of explaining, at least in the cooperative field here-I mentioned at the beginning of our testimony the members of our committee serve 35 million Americans out there on farms and credit unions and rural electric cooperatives, Land 'O Lake et cetera. It is only the last 2 or 3 years that our members have made a conscious effort to include in every regional meeting, whether it is in Kansas, Denver, Colorado, or where it is, a 2-hour or half-day session on international development.

We have put together some fairly sophisticated slide presentations, multiple-screen and so forth, and we are surprised at the number of people who will come to a session like that in Denver or Kansas or someplace, and really ask good questions, hard questions.

But we are doing more of that in the last two years. And we should have been doing it for the last 20 years.

Chairman PATTERSON. Any other comments? The panel this morning was very good on this point as well. The public education question is being approached. I think we are finally recognizing we need to build grass roots support for this type of institution that is often-let's face it, it is far from on the tip of the tongue of the average constituent.

Mr. RINES. I would like to reiterate that. Really what you said was pretty much what I had in mind saying-the need for the committee and ourselves to make a concerted effort in this regard and to do it in a way that it reaches people who not only have a vested interest in understanding it and wanting to understand it, but in a way that they can appreciate the fact that this is largely an investment that is going to be beneficial to them, not only this year, but the next and down the road.

Chairman PATTERSON. Well, I have found that the more I learn of the issues, the more I support the MDB's, and the more strongly I become an advocate of them.

I find that whenever you talk to anyone, and they are willing to get a little bit more informed on the subject matter, they are amazed at the benefits and become supporters.

So I think there is great potential in the future in this area if we can get that message out, to not only the vested interests, as you said, Mr. Rines, but also the man on the street so they understand

there is a long-term benefit to the country in many ways. It may not touch them personally in their lives, but it is very, very helpful to world peace and our strength and jobs and every other way to improve humankind.

Well, before I get too philosophical, let me say this has been a very stimulating hearing all day long. Sorry about the interruptions.

This panel has been most enlightening, as was our morning panel. Tomorrow morning it is the intention of the Chair to pull together our subcommittee for a markup of the bill in regard to the MDB's. I think your testimony has reinforced and assured many of our newer members of the need to adopt legislation, and not only adopt it, but move it as rapidly as possible.

I want to thank you, on behalf of Mr. Bereuter, who before he left asked me to make that same point for him, so you can understand that this is a bipartisan push, in an effort to get the bills passed and restore any confidence that may have been shaken a little bit in terms of multilateral development support by Congress and the administration. Thank you very much.

[Whereupon, at 3:30 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned subject to call of the Chair.]

APPENDIX

ADDITIONAL MATERIAL SUBMITTED FOR INCLUSION IN THE RECORD

(1) Special report on the Asian Development Bank [ADB], a special supplement to the Washington Post magazine of Sunday, April 24, 1983.

(2) State Department views on H.R. 2586, submitted by Assistant Secretary of State for Humanitarian Affairs Elliot Abrams.

(3) Kidder, Peabody & Co., Report on the Asian Development Bank, submitted by Edward J. Waters.